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Old 01-29-2013, 10:22 AM   #1
Bob Gardner
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Default Known British Prop Makers of WW1

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Originally Posted by Brett Robb View Post
Bob, For future reference this may or may not help your research, but I found this company in England still in business with an interesting fact listed in their history ~ 1908 Company began trading as A.Edmonds & Co. Ltd. During the Great War, the company used its’ skills to fabricate Lewis gun chests and cartridge cases, and later also began to supply mahogany aircraft propellers to Daimler. I have not noticed them being mentioned on the forum before.
Brett

Brett,

Thank you so much for this news. I have just finished my six books on British Prop Makers of WW1 so naturally two more have now appeared. Edmonds, whom you discovered and a firm called Jouques, of whom I know nothing except that a blade with their decal appeared on eBay, which I bought for my collection.

I have written to Edmunds to ask if they have any archives or photographs of their prop making days. They probably don't! Several firms that still exist whom I have contacted did not even know of their activities in WW1.

Here's a list of those I've discovered so far. I'm sure a few more will be discovered.

Air Department of the Admiralty
Air Board (later the Air Ministry)
Aircraft Construction Co
Aircraft Manufacturing Co Ltd
Airscrew Co Ltd
Aldam Heaton & Co Ltd
Austin Motor Co Ltd
Avanti Manufacturing Co

Barker & Co
Barber, EL
Bath Aircraft Ltd
Beardmore, William & Co Ltd
Beney, Robert & Co
Berwick, FW & Co Ltd
Betjemann, G & Sons Ltd.
Bianco, D Ltd
Blackburn Aeroplane & Motor Co
Blake, WE Ltd
Boulton & Paul Ltd
Brinsmead, John & Sons Ltd
British & Colonial Aeroplane Co Ltd
Broadwood, John & Sons
Brush Electrical Engineering Co

Clark, T W K & Co
Clayton & Shuttleworth Ltd
Cleaver, HC Ltd
Cochrane Propeller Co
Cohen, B & Sons Ltd
Courtney Pope & Co Ltd
Curtis, J & Sons
Cravens Ltd.

Darracq Motor Engineering Co Ltd
Davidson Aviation Co Ltd
Davies, Bennett & Co
Denny, William & Brothers Ltd
Dick, Kerr & Co Ltd
Dixon Bros. & Hutchinson
DMD Ltd.
Dove Bros

Ebora Propeller Co Ltd
Edmunds & Co
English Electric Co Ltd
Evans, Joseph & Sons

Fairey Aviation Ltd
Falcon Airscrew Co
Farringdon Engineering Co

General Aeronautical Co Ltd
Gould Brothers
Glover & Co
Grahame-White Aviation Co Ltd

Hamptons (owned by Waring & Gillow)
Handley Page Ltd
Hermann & Phillips
Hooper & Co Ltd
Horsman, Thomas
Humber Ltd
Horsman, Thomas
Humboldt Ltd

Integral Propeller Co Ltd

Jouques Aircraft Works

Kearley, CF
Kerr Pattern Co
Kingsbury Aviation Co Ltd

Lang Propeller Ltd
London Aircraft Co
Longhurst & Skinner
Lucraft & Westcott Ltd

Mann Egerton & Co Ltd
Maple & Co Ltd
Marsh Jones & Cribb Ltd
Marshall Sons & Co Ltd
Martinsyde Ltd
Martyn, HH & Co Ltd
Messenger & Co
Miller, RP & Co
Morris & Co Ltd

Oddy, WD & Co
Ogilvie & Co

Page, Trevor & Co Ltd (Trepaco)
Parnall & Sons
Pearce, Harold E & Co (Hepaco)
Pemberton Billing Ltd
Phoenix Dynamo Manufacturing
Portholme Aerodrome Ltd
Pratt, Christopher & Sons Ltd
Presland Brothers
Prestige & Co Ltd

Ransome Sims & Jefferies Ltd
Rippers Ltd
Robey & Co Ltd
Roe, AV & Co Ltd
Rolfe, M
Royal Aircraft Factory
Ruston Proctor & Co Ltd

Sage, Frederick & Co Ltd
Saunders, SE Ltd
Shapland & Petter Ltd
Shard, J & Co
Short Brothers
Siddeley Deasy & Co Ltd
Standard Motor Co Ltd
Stanley Aviation Co
Supermarine Aviation Works Ltd

Tamworth Hindley & Co
Thompson, John & Co
Thompson, Norman Flight Co Ltd
Thornton Engineering Ltd
Tibbenham Ltd
Trollope & Colls Ltd
Turner Lord & Co

Valkyrie Propellers
Vickers Ltd Crayford
Vickers Ltd Weybridge
Vickers Wolseley Motors Ltd

Waring & Gillow Ltd
Waring’s Aviation Co Ltd
Watling, RS & Sons
Weiss Propeller
Weir
Westland Aircraft Works
WHC Co
White Allom & Co
Whitehead Aircraft Co Ltd
White, J Samuel & Co Ltd
White & Thompson
Willett, William
Witton, Witton & Co
Wolseley Motors Ltd

With kind regards,

Bob
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Old 01-29-2013, 05:45 PM   #2
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Hello Bob, It may be unrelated to A. Edmonds & Co. But my Lang of America and several other propellers from North American makers have appeared on this forum with the name A.J. Edmonds stamped on them, a couple of which were also stamped defective right next to his name. All these propellers also have a connection to Canadian Aeroplanes Ltd. Probably just a coincidence or possibly they were contracted to consult. assist or train other makers or Canadian Aeroplanes Ltd.

Brett
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Old 01-30-2013, 07:02 AM   #3
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'Morning Brett,

I have spoken to David Edmonds, the current managing director of Edmonds. His grandfather wrote a history of the company and a few pages describe their activities during WW1. They are sending me a copy.

The thought crossed my mind too about the Canadian firm of Edmonds. It might be a parallel to Watts and Lang in the USA. I'll wait and see what I can discover when the book extract arrives.

Many thanks for telling me about this lead.

With kind regards,

Bob
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Old 02-27-2014, 04:28 PM   #4
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Here is a nice picture of Crossley Tender and trailer transporting boxed Propellers by Barker & Co

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Old 02-28-2014, 06:43 AM   #5
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Marvellous; thank you so much! This is a superb photograph.

I have added a new folder to my photograph library entitled 'new stuff for British Props second edition.' And your photo is the first addition. I have several others, perhaps many others, which I must gather and put in this folder but at the moment I'm concentrating on completing my books on German props.

With kind regards,

Bob
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Old 02-28-2014, 05:22 PM   #6
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Hi Bob

I am putting together an article for the Crossley Register, an organisation which you probably are not aware of as the number of all surviving Crossleys is low, and only a handful from the Great War are still extant, two of which are in my hands.
I am including this image and would like to write a few words about Barker & Co, such as where they were from and what they did prior or post WW1.
If you could help in this matter it would help to elevate me to new heights in the register!
Here is a collection of Pathe clips I stuck together a few years back and show a prop being taken to an stricken aircraft - staged for the camera I am sure.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x6rLSXwgHWw

I will be at Stow Maries, Essex, with the Crossleys and P&M motorcycles for the Fly In on the 10th of May along with 7 of Peter Jacksons WW1 aircraft.

Thanks

Tom
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Old 02-28-2014, 06:04 PM   #7
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Hi,

Thanks for the link! From 3:20 to 4:10 it shows the replacement of an airscrew. How it was fitted to the engine? I just see one center nut screwed on... Kind of a "quick system"? Or was the metallic hub already fitted on propellers (possible view of this one at 3:31)?

Regards,
PM
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Old 03-02-2014, 07:54 AM   #8
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Bonjour Pierre-Michel,

I don't think there was anything unusual. The film doesn't show each of the eight bolts being fastened, nor the castellated nuts or locking wire fitted through the holes in each bolt. I don't believe the British had a quick release and fastening hub. Lucien Chauvière developed one to the prototype stage before WW1. Do you have any information on it? Rupp in Germany developed his successful one with a central nut, around 1917 and his company continued well into WW2. The thought always occurs that Rupp might have worked for the German Branch of Chauvière's Integral company, seen details of their quick-release mechanism and developed it himself to successful widespread use.

Avec le Respect,

Bob
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Old 03-02-2014, 08:26 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Charawacky View Post
Hi Bob

I am putting together an article for the Crossley Register, an organisation which you probably are not aware of as the number of all surviving Crossleys is low, and only a handful from the Great War are still extant, two of which are in my hands.

I am including this image and would like to write a few words about Barker & Co, such as where they were from and what they did prior or post WW1.

I will be at Stow Maries, Essex, with the Crossleys and P&M motorcycles for the Fly In on the 10th of May along with 7 of Peter Jacksons WW1 aircraft.

Thanks

Tom
'Morning Tom,

Thank you so much for telling us about this film clip. It had never occurred to me to look for WW1 aircraft on U-tube, although I watch clips of my other passion; motor sport. I have several hours of exploring ahead of me!

I know almost nothing about Barker's. They were the famous coach builders of Rolls-Royce etc and typical of famous leading firms in that they had knowledge of mass production of wooden objects. They were recruited late in WW1 to make aircraft propellers.

I enclose below the text of my section about Barker's. I have some photographs in my book. Send me an email to aeroclocksatbtinternetdotcom (written thus to evade the spambots) and I'll send a pdf of the section with photographs. But I emphasise that I know very little about Barker's.

With kind regards,

Bob


Barker & Co Ltd
66-68 South Audley Street, London.
Works at Olaf Street, Latimer Road, Nottinghill, London

The company was a leading London coachbuilder, primarily in wood, and were ideally placed in WW1 to take on war work such as making propellers, which it made from 1916 to 1919.

The company was formed in 1710 by one of Queen Anne’s Guards Officers. He became prominent during the reign of George III who favoured him. His company continued to hold the Royal Warrant for successive reigns making at least twenty coaches for Queen Victoria and car bodies for King Edward VII and King George V. In 1905 or 1903 (references vary) they became body suppliers to Rolls Royce cars.

During the nineteenth century the premises were at 66 Chandos Street, off the Strand in central London. In 1909 the works was at Olaf Street in Shepherd’s Bush and the offices and showroom at South Audley Street in Mayfair. The company’s letterhead in Figure 91 was rather busy. Of note is the Royal Warrant, centre, which indicated that Barker’s provided cars and ceremonial horse-drawn coaches to King George V.

Figure 91 Barker letterhead
Figure 94 Barker advert


I have not found a complete example of a Barker made propeller. This photo shows a single blade, the only known example of their work, probably. The hub remnant below is probably from a Barker & Co propeller and appears to be the 43rd prop made and is dated 1916. (It’s not the stamp of the British & Colonial Aeroplane Company.)

Figure 98 Probable Barker propeller hub

The company closed in 1938 and was taken over by Hooper.
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Old 03-02-2014, 12:30 PM   #10
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Hi Bob

The image I posted of the Crossley with trailer and boxed props is taken on the Jerusalem-Jericho Road just outside Jerusalem undergoing repairs, immediately after the advance of our troops using all the local labour to rebuild the road.

On a different topic which you mention there is a u tube video of my old Bentley taking a trip around le mans which may interest you.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j9bhTfpw54o

Tom
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