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Old 12-03-2009, 12:10 PM   #11
Tue
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Hi pmdec

Interesting fact about the french propellers. Thanks

The first two flying boats that the Danish Marine acquired in 1913 were french "Donnet-Leveque. A guy called H.P Christensen modified the two airplanes to make them more stabile, and later manufactured 8 flying boats of his own design but based on the French models. The new models were called F.B which stands for Flying boat bi-plan.

The planes were constructed at Orlogsværftet in Copenhagen, which he left in 1918, the same year my propeller was manufactured. So he was probably overseeing the construction

Source
Google Book

Last edited by Tue; 12-03-2009 at 12:22 PM.
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Old 12-03-2009, 12:54 PM   #12
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Note to myself

The original Mågen 21 "O.V.15, May 1917" was replaced by another Mågen 21 "O.V.21, July 1918". Other sources suggest that the 21 was renamed 22 after it was rebuild. The prop. is dated 1918 June 15th.

The F.B.IV engine
Mågen 21/22, 200 hp Curtiss

F.B.III engines
Mågen 4/14, 100 hp Curtiss
Mågen 5/12,100 hp Gnome Monosaupape
Mågen 6/11, 100 hp Mercedes
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Old 12-03-2009, 02:01 PM   #13
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Hi,

I hope you will post pictures of the other sides of the hub when you will get the prop !

Regards,
PM
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Old 12-03-2009, 07:18 PM   #14
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If the weather is good, I will pick it up tomorrow morning. I will of course measure it and take lot's of pictures.
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Old 12-04-2009, 12:03 PM   #15
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I got some new pics and measurements for you:




It comes close to the LeRhone 80HP on your data sheet, but the Center Bore and Bolt Circle is a little off?


pmdec>
"The prop seems a tractor one, as central bore on extrados is not flared (I am not sure of the right word)."

Could you elaborate on this?

Last edited by Tue; 12-04-2009 at 12:14 PM.
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Old 12-04-2009, 12:31 PM   #16
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If it is a tractor propeller and used for a land aircraft, I am guessing that the motor it has been used for is a Thulin 90HP. This would be a great place to start.

If I super impose the picture of my prop on this image it matches beautifully. Even the metal rim fit's.
Thulin_typ_D

Very likely

Södertälje S. W. 17 1917-1924
Thulin, 90 HP


Likely

Caudron 1912-1922
Le Rhone, 60 HP, rotating

Nielsen & Winther Type Aa 1917-1924
Thulin A, 90 HP

Last edited by Tue; 12-04-2009 at 01:02 PM.
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Old 12-04-2009, 06:27 PM   #17
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Hi,

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tue View Post
.../...
pmdec>
"The prop seems a tractor one, as central bore on extrados is not flared (I am not sure of the right word)."

Could you elaborate on this?
As you can see, central bore on your prop has different ends on "front" and "back". It is due to the shape of metallic parts attached to engine to get the prop properly fitted. I join a sheme of one : first, blue side is fitted to engine axle. After, the prop is mounted. Third, the red plate and bolts. So, except when prop is mounted
- directly mounted on engine crankcase (> very large central bore, no less than 14cm to my knowledge),
- between engine and aircraft (no more in use in 1918, I think),

in all ather cases (rotating engine or not), to my knowledge :
- when enlarged bore is same side than propeller intrados (as yours), it is a tractor prop,
- when enlarged bore is same side than propeller extrados, it is a pusher prop.

Good research !

Regards,
PM
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Old 12-06-2009, 05:07 PM   #18
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Hi pmdec

I really appreciate the info, it has helped me alot.

Unfortunately I still need to find the correct HUB meassurements for several engines before I can narrow my search.

Does either Bob or you have engines in your database which has not been updated on this site?
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Old 12-07-2009, 08:07 AM   #19
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Hi,

I have no French prop with your hub measurements (in more than 1000 data lines). The only 65mm central bore I heard of is a Chauvière serial 3095 with a diameter of 3m40 and I don't know its destination. It is from a database which have many errors. In this range of diameter I have many props with 60mm (many for hubs "type B") and with 70mm (many for hubs "type C"), but only 3 between (1 with 65mm and 2 with 68mm).

In 1918, I think metallic hubs dimensions were imposed by military, so they were different in each country. Your measurements are clearly metric, but they are not French.
For me, the only reliable data I found were in official archives.

I think you have to turn to military archives, but which ones?

I there is not archives, you can just made a guess for the engine power, and it will be impossible to know about the aircraft : that often happens !
In other hand, your guess about Thulin type D seems a good one ...

Regards,
PM
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Old 12-07-2009, 10:23 AM   #20
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Your information really does point in the direction that this prop. was made for an aircrat tailored by the danish army.

In this forum I got the measurements for a Le Rhone type C HUB, on which basis I am ruling out aircrafts with a Le Rhone 60HP and a Gnome 80HP rotary engine.

This does really leave me with two aircrafts using a Thulin engine. One of these aircrafts have been made as a replica by a Danish museum, which I have contacted. All I can do now is wait.

There is also an aircraft with an Angus 140HP engine, but it seams too powerfull for my 2500mm prop? I have already discarded a Mercedes 120HP on that basis. The pictures I have found of these aircrafts all show a propeller of approx. 3m, measured to the men standing next to.

If I do find a match to the Thulin engine and get a confirmation that T.V does stand for Tøjhuseværkstederne. The next challenge is to indentify the planes, cause they themselves looks custom made, prob. not even based on a license.
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