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WW1 four bladed wooden propeller

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  • WW1 four bladed wooden propeller

    Hello There

    I am trying to trace any information about my Grandfathers reputedly being the first man to manufacture a four bladed wooden propeller.

    His name was William Samuel Browne.

    Either before or during the first world war, he was an engineer patternmaker, like my father, and he was commisioned to make the propeller.

    I know that one of the West London (Chiswick, Hammersmith, Brentford areas) newspapers ran an article with a picture on the subject, but I am having trouble finding it.

    Does anyone have any information or suggestions on how to proceed further with my quest.

    Regards
    Chris

  • #2
    Good Afternoon Christopher,

    I have not come across any record of who made the first four-bladed prop in Great Britain. I do have a note in my book that...... In early 1914 the Lang Company in Weybridge employed eight people, the foreman of whom was a Mr Hook, a trained cabinet-maker who, by repute, made the first prop to meet the Government's wartime standards.

    Early props were carved from the solid wood. This would be around 1908-1909.

    The first British prop shops would have been those of the first aircraft makers such as Short in Kent, Avro in Manchester or Handley Page. Replacement props became available when the General Aviation Company started to produce after-market spares.

    I'll do some follow-up work to see who was the earliest in West London.

    With kind regards,

    Bob
    Bob Gardner
    Author; WW1 British Propellers, WWI German Propellers
    http://www.aeroclocks.com

    Comment


    • #3
      Thanks for this Bob, I'll make enquiries with Weybridge Library, I live not far from there in Ottershaw.
      I'll keep you informed if I come up with anything.
      Regards
      Chris

      Comment


      • #4
        Christopher,

        I have looked through the Flight magazine archives from 1909. There are lots of references to four bladed props, often made from bent sheet-aluminium fastened to rods and by 1910 carved wooden four-bladed props were in use.

        Louis Bleriot initially used a four bladed prop on his aircraft in 1909 but for his channel crossing and thereafter used a two-bladed prop made by Lucien Chauviere, who was the most significant prop designer, whom everyone else copied.

        But no reference to the first British four bladed prop. Samual Cody was using them in 1909 and 1910 and AV Roe was in 1910, so that is the sort of date you should be searching in.

        I suspect that there must be a caveat to the statement The first man to make a four bladed prop. It might be in London, it might refer to the first company to make props in Britain and these were probably the aircraft makers, Short Bros, AV Roe, Handley Page and the British & Colonial Co (aka Bristol).

        The first company to offer replacement props was the General Aviation Contractors Company in EC2 but they bought in their props from Regy in France. There were several early companies making props by 1910 but very little is known of them.

        For further research you might wish to try the Flight archives that can be viewed on line, and the National Record Office at Kew where indexes can be viewed on line and booked for you to see once you arrive there.

        Please tell me what you find.

        With kind regards,

        Bob
        Last edited by Bob Gardner; 05-24-2010, 06:43 AM.
        Bob Gardner
        Author; WW1 British Propellers, WWI German Propellers
        http://www.aeroclocks.com

        Comment


        • #5
          Bob.

          It's not as clear cut as I would have liked, I tried Weybridge Library and I now have many new avenues to go down.
          Brooklands museum are useing some of their researchers to investigate and I will also try Collingwood British Newspaper Library.
          Why couldn't grandad be a dustman?

          Many regards
          Chris

          Comment


          • #6
            Chris,

            I am only too aware of the validity of your frustration. I have about a hundred loose ends in my research on WW1 props. Running up hill in sand springs often to mind!

            Tell me if you discover anything.

            Bob
            Bob Gardner
            Author; WW1 British Propellers, WWI German Propellers
            http://www.aeroclocks.com

            Comment


            • #7
              An afterthought; The word propeller today has a different meaning from its use in 1909 to 1910. Then it meant something which propelled; in other words a pusher air screw. The other type was called a tractor screw.

              Bob
              Last edited by Bob Gardner; 05-26-2010, 06:14 AM.
              Bob Gardner
              Author; WW1 British Propellers, WWI German Propellers
              http://www.aeroclocks.com

              Comment


              • #8
                I just received this from Brooklands which nudges me a bit closer and adds to what Bob wrote erlier.
                Regards
                Chris

                Dear Mr Brown,

                Thank you for your message which has been passed to me.

                I have not been able to find much information on Mr Browne but it seems that he owned Lang, a maker of propellers at Weybridge and it is suggested that the four-bladed propeller may have originated there, perhaps made by a Mr Hook the foreman. I found this information on the web but can't back it up with any other evidence.

                I'm sorry that I can't help further but should I find anything else I will, of course, let you know. Perhaps. on your part you could let us have any information that you may find to add to our archives.

                Best wishes.

                Phil. Clifford.
                Brooklands Museum Library volunteer.



                'Brooklands Museum is an independent charitable trust and does not charge for routine research enquiries. Any donation you are willing to give will be gratefully received. Cheques payable please to Brooklands Museum Trust' (Brooklands Road,Weybridge,Surrey KT13 0QN.)

                Comment


                • #9
                  Good Afternoon Chris,

                  I don't think your grandfather owned the Lang Prop Co. Dashwood Lang owned it! And I have no reference to a Browne involved with Lang. You might wish to ask Mr Clifford what information he has found.

                  In 1909 Lang became interested in aircraft propeller design and took out a patent in conjunction with a barrister, Algernon Flint and a toy dealer, Herbert Hughes and made some propellers in his own name. In 1910 he went to work for British & Colonial in their prop shop, and may have been the manager. He left in 1912 and set up again as a prop maker in partnership with a David Garnett at the existing Riverside Works in Weybridge, which lay on an island at the junction of The Wey River, the Wey Canal and the River Thames. The company was called Lang, Garnett & Co. and Lang was 29. In August 1913, when Flight magazine reported on the company, it was already making propellers for Sopwith and had a contract for BE2 four-bladed props from the Royal Aircraft Factory.

                  The partnership with David Garnett lasted only a few months. Flight recorded on 4 October 1913 that Mr DE Garnett has severed his connection with the company. A new Limited Company was registered in October 1913 known as Lang Propeller Ltd with Lang, Monteith and Sprott as directors and a nominal capital of £4000.

                  Tommy Sopwith was unusual as a maker in that he did not have an in-house prop shop and in consequence was dependent on outside sources; TWK Clark and the Integral Prop Company as well as Lang. In consequence he bought a share of the Lang company and he and Dennis Herbert became additional directors. In 1917 Sopwith bought the remainder of the company and both Lang and Sprot retired whereupon Lang’s became a subsidiary of Sopwith’s. It was now, in effect, Sopwith’s prop department.

                  However, any laminated prop described in any context as the first would have been made around 1909-1911.

                  With kind regards,

                  Bob
                  Bob Gardner
                  Author; WW1 British Propellers, WWI German Propellers
                  http://www.aeroclocks.com

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Ah well, it's that waking up hill on sand thing, I've forwarded your comments on to Brooklands, probably hear from them next week.
                    Regards
                    Chris

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Chris,

                      How old was your grandfather in 1909-1910? In other words, do you know his year of birth? I might then be able to find his address in the census.

                      With kind regards,

                      Bob
                      Bob Gardner
                      Author; WW1 British Propellers, WWI German Propellers
                      http://www.aeroclocks.com

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Bob
                        One of my brothers has done that already, he was born in 1879 in Staines Middlesex, lived in Chertsey Surrey and then eventually Kingston on Thames in 1901.
                        I don't know about the 1911 census.
                        Regards
                        Chris

                        Comment

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